Cheated then lied. sorry so long

[LOL_OMG]

Originally Posted by SouthBond

We think that you need to forgive her and continue to think about swinging. Thirteen years is a long time to just flush. If you have been talking about swinging. Emailing people about swinging. Meeting people about swinging. She has had previous experiences. You have been building up an anticipation of having sex with another person. She was ready for action. She was hot to trot. Give her the benefit of doubt and give her another chance. You have been talking about her having sex with other people. She just got a little ahead you. If she continues to play games, dump her. We can assume that you are absolutely perfect. Can't we?

Ummm....HUH? Oops sorry I meant to say

WTF?

Swinging for us requires trust. If either was to break that trust and (from what the OP says downright LIE) the swinging and probably the relationship would be over. As for single guys, they're not the marriage police. He wasn't obligated to get your permission...she was.

Mrs

[VegasLee]

Originally Posted by SouthBond

We think that you need to forgive her and continue to think about swinging.

Yep, always a good idea to throw a drowning man an anchor.

[intuition897]

If recovering from an affair is a twelve-step process, getting back to swinging is...oh...about step 30.

I agree with SouthBond in one respect: 13 years IS a lot of time to flush away...I guess the Mrs. should've thought about that before she fucked it away. Whether you forgive her or not is up to you, but if I were you, I'd wait until she's hurting (a LOT) from the realization of what she's done to you and your marriage with her stupidity. Unless she fully (FULLY) understands what she threw away with her dishonesty, the begging for forgiveness you see right now is nothing but damage control. Pat things down, smooth things over, "There there there, SEE?? ALL better...right? Honey?" Don't fall for it. Cheating changes things, even after the couple recovers. There's always scar tissue and it aches when the storms blow through. Not much, but always just enough to remind you that things have changed. Unless you wait, she'll do it again. Guaranteed.

[rpu3]

Originally Posted by SouthBond

We think that you need to forgive her and continue to think about swinging.

Wow, that's two posts from you in one day that leaving me wondering if we are even reading the same board!

Originally Posted by SouthBond

You have been building up an anticipation of having sex with another person. She was ready for action. She was hot to trot. Give her the benefit of doubt and give her another chance. You have been talking about her having sex with other people. She just got a little ahead you. If she continues to play games, dump her.

I think it's safe to say that he anticipated that he and his wife were going to be swinging together. This isn't jumping the gun - she went well beyond that point.

If I pulled that stunt on my spouse (the cheating/behind his back stunts), our "swinging" would be over. I'd be lucky if he were willing to consider counseling with me, and I'm sure it would be long time before he had any trust in me, if ever. The best thing out of swinging is that we are completely honest with each other, no matter what form our activities take. There are no games, no deceit, no going ahead of the other. I thought that was the point of swinging - we didn't need to lie to do something different.

As to the OP - I am so sorry that you are in this situation. I can only imagine what you might be thinking and feeling at this point. I don't even know how you are working and functioning at this point. I hope you do consider seeing a counselor, even if it is by yourself, as another support system.

[fun4Ds]

Originally Posted by Confused In PA

We've been together 13 years and have had the same problems that all couples have. Perhaps this is her way of telling me it's not working.

In addition to the obvious advice has anyone had experience talking to a psychologist about a situation like this? I am not feeling so good about myself since this happened and know for sure that I need to talk to someone about how I feel. I can't sleep, can't eat and work is becoming very difficult. I can talk to her but that won't be enough.

curious, this is a pretty serious issue. i can somehow relate to your needs for advice and i dont want to compare problems,or share mine. ours are diffrent.yet swinging was involved in mine/ours as well.

people have diffrent oppinions and this is something i would have to say needs profesional help. there is nothing to be ashamed of in seeking some counseling be it alone or together. mr.fun

[sereneiders]

Originally Posted by SouthBond

We think that you need to forgive her and continue to think about swinging. Thirteen years is a long time to just flush. If you have been talking about swinging. Emailing people about swinging. Meeting people about swinging. She has had previous experiences. You have been building up an anticipation of having sex with another person. She was ready for action. She was hot to trot. Give her the benefit of doubt and give her another chance. You have been talking about her having sex with other people. She just got a little ahead you. If she continues to play games, dump her. We can assume that you are absolutely perfect. Can't we?

This is the reverse from the same coin I mentioned in my previous post.

SouthBond, I don't know what lead you to provide this advice, but the OP isn't YOU.

I am pretty sure he have well grounded motivations to feel the way he does about being betrayed, and it is posible that his wife had a grounded motivation to act the way she did.

We shouldn't deprive those motivations from it value, without knowing more about the whole thing. We just don't have enough information as to provide an advice.

So far, the only one we can talk about is the OP.

Later on he asked for advice about the vaule of seeking for professional help, and I believe this is a wise measure to take.

[havefuninsun]

I wouldn't blame the single guy at all -- we don't have enough information. Hell, she could have lied to that dude and said you were all on board with her meeting him, etc. ...

SHE was completely in the wrong. For the life of me, I will never understand cheating swingers ... seems like a oxymoron to me. Think about it ... your spouse will allow you to fuck other people ... why in the HELL would you cheat for sex? If she's cheating, it's for other reasons.

Take the swinging out of the mix for now. Work on your marriage (if it's worth working on). Once you are strong in your marriage, THEN you MAY be able to broach the subject again.

Sorry you're going through all of this.

[Confused In PA]

so after some time to deal with this mess, I've asked her the obvious question, Why? Her reply was "I don't know, it was just sex" and "it didn't mean anything"

I don't know what others might think but I don't buy this. There is/was a reason, there's always a reason and YES it did "mean something" to me.

So as not to aggravate an already tense situation I've asked her to write me an apology letter and "try" to explain what would possibly make her think that this would be o.k. I'm not expecting anything more than what I've already heard but who knows. I'm still baffled how someone who is otherwise very responsible would meet with a complete stranger whom WE only met once.
To me that is just plain stupid.

One other note, I created a single profile on Swing Lifestyle just to see if the guy was still around and his profile was set to "invisibile" 133 days ago. Now I'm wondering if it really was a one time thing. There are too many things that don't make sense to me.

Lastly, I mentioned that I should have taken to heart things I read about single males. I do not blame him, I blame HER. I also blame myself and can't help but think we should have looked for another couple. Then maybe, not a guarantee, but maybe this could have been avoided.

[slolrner]

Well as for me I would have the locks changed after she went to work and be done with the whole thing.

There is not one thing or for that matter any number of things she can do to restore this relationship - sorry but it is done, unless you find some pleasure in being a cuckold.

Wasting your time trying to restore this relationship will be just that - wasting your time. Spend your time in the search for someone that understands and has appreciation for honesty and integrity.

[ShellyM]

Well, lets not jump the gun and change locks. OP, this is YOUR marriage. We do not know you nor your wife. From what you have said yes. She was absolutely in the wrong here, and I do consider what she did to be cheating. I don't understand WHY for the life of me.....all she had to do was say yes, she was interested and you would have done an MFM! Wow, all of this could have been avoided. If you are now thinking that she had a relationship with this man then you are talking a whole new can of issues. I honestly don't know what to tell you other than what I would do in the same situation possibly: Number one, seek a counselor. If you think your marriage is salvageable (13 years is a long time to throw away, so be sure you have really pondered before you consider the D word) seek marriage counseling immediately. I would probably stop sex with her at this point. I would not be able to make love to a woman that I don't trust, but thats my opinion only. You may want to seek your own private counselor even if you are also in marital counseling. I think that even if your marriage were to end you need help in dealing with all of the emotions you are feeling. I have never experieneced them, but I know you are hurting. Married or divorced you have got to deal with these emotions and anger so that you can move forward and have a happy life. But the "it was just sex" bit? I don't buy it for a second. Best of luck to you.
Shelly

[intuition897]

Originally Posted by Confused In PA

so after some time to deal with this mess, I've asked her the obvious question, Why? Her reply was "I don't know, it was just sex" and "it didn't mean anything"

I don't know what others might think but I don't buy this. There is/was a reason, there's always a reason and YES it did "mean something" to me.

Precisely. I think the trouble is that your wife still thinks that you're upset because she had sex with another man. But that isn't it, is it? It was the lie. Whether or not it was "just sex" is irrelevant to the real issue, which is that she was okay with deceiving you. Why didn't she just tell you? Oh, I know this one...because if she had, it would mean that there was a distinct possibility that she wouldn't get what she wanted. And she had to have what she wanted. ASKING for your input would mean that she would have to compromise. She didn't trust your desire to make her happy; she had to make it happen for herself without giving you the opportunity to do it for her. You weren't given any choice.

Dude, you have every right to be pissed off. Hell, I'm pissed off and I'm not even married to her.

Originally Posted by Confused In PA

I'm still baffled how someone who is otherwise very responsible would meet with a complete stranger whom WE only met once.
To me that is just plain stupid.

Yeah, no one really touched on that issue, did they? It's one of the reasons we don't play solo. Most people are pretty nice, but it only takes one freak who is off his meds to drop something in your drink and you wake up the next morning - if you're lucky! - with a pussy full of God knows what. Or maybe your husband never sees you again. Even in the best case scenario, where you come home after being assaulted, what are you going to do about it? Go to the police? Yeah. Sure.

Originally Posted by Confused In PA

Lastly, I mentioned that I should have taken to heart things I read about single males. I do not blame him, I blame HER. I also blame myself and can't help but think we should have looked for another couple. Then maybe, not a guarantee, but maybe this could have been avoided.

While the single guy, if he was a man of any integrity, should have refused her once he knew her game, perhaps it's too much to hope for. That's still beside the point. The bottom line is that it doesn't matter what the rest of the world's intentions are. What matters is the decision we each make for our own relationships.

[Tybee Swing]

Originally Posted by Confused In PA

so after some time to deal with this mess, I've asked her the obvious question, Why? Her reply was "I don't know, it was just sex" and "it didn't mean anything"

My #1 problem with her reason/response to you is her complete lack of empathy and respect for you. Where are you in her answer? So "it didn't mean anything" to her. She is only responding to the sex, not to the real questions: "WHY did you go behind my back, after we emailed and turned him down as a couple, which was our joint decision? Why did you pursue him and not tell me? Why did you meet him and fuck him without me there? Do you think that what you did (going behind my back) is in ANY way related to the swinging we talked about?"

As a wife, why did she not consider at all what it may or may not mean to you?

These are the things that I would want to know. It would be all about her complete lack of respect for you, and what appears to be her lack of caring how you feel.

I hope that you're doing okay, and I really hope that you do get some counseling for yourself to help you get through this, regardless of the outcome with your wife.

[sereneiders]

I agree with Tybee Swing, and that sort of "why" was the one I meant before.

You're right in feeling deceived and it is up to you to decide if it worth the effort to save your marriage.

Of course, the easiest option here is to divorce. It's so "easy" to advice you to go for this choice, and even now how to do it, feeding your anger and so on, that I feel this option doesn't require any further comment or discussion (unless you start a "how to divorce" thread).

So, I stick to the first option, not as an advice to follow, but just given the chance that you could be pondering it and it'd be more valuable a comment on the harder option.

What I don't quite get it yet is this. You two seemed to have a great communication, to the point of being open to discuss swinging and meet this single guy. She was next to you for 13 years. Yet, suddenly, she shows you a completelly new, compeletty deceiving face to you?

What's hard to understand for me is, how it is possible that someone able to do what she did, in the terms you put the events, didn't give you any clue of this face along all those years?

Unless having a mind health problem able to produce unexpected behaviors (like being hit with a hammer in the back of her head), people doesn't change so dramatically from one day to the next. Of course, we all change, but it is often a slow peaced process, and people arond you notices "something is going wrong".

This question goes beyond this relationship outcome, because I believe there were hints you didn't notice, for whatever reason, and, what guarantees you that you wouldn't notice this sort of clues again, with your wife or with someone new?

And back tho this relationship, I wonder if there wasnt's some sort of denial of "evidences" from you when discussing the whole swinging idea with your wife. This is something we've seen a couple of times around here: the guy so turned on by the swinging idea, focused mostly in the pleasure he would get from this (even if making the wife "perform" with another guy), and unaware ot the effect on the wife (like "but... she got out of the closet and now she wants more than what I want"), that pursuing his own fantasies doesn't take a look (or doesn't want to take a look) of what's going on around him.

I am not telling this is your case, since I don't know. It's an example of one of MANY different scenarios where my question could be answered.

And I believe it is important for you (and you alone, here) to be able to recognize the scenario, as to be able to avoid it in the future, wheter with your wife or with someone else.

[sereneiders]

Originally Posted by intuition897

It's one of the reasons we don't play solo. Most people are pretty nice, but it only takes one freak who is off his meds to drop something in your drink and you wake up the next morning - if you're lucky! - with a pussy full of God knows what. Or maybe your husband never sees you again. Even in the best case scenario, where you come home after being assaulted, what are you going to do about it? Go to the police? Yeah. Sure.

This is a reason you don't play solo? Seriously, this may happen to any single gal (or guy?) dating someone new... and for the sake of bumping against someone off his meds, you don't have to be a swinger to face a nightmare like this one.

I believe if you make a list of 10 reasons for not playing solo, this should be the last one to worry about, since you don't need an stretched example involving a psychotic guy to call for troubles.

Of course, this guy looks like a bastard for me at first glance, but it's important to point out we fear this from single guys preciselly because this is a "normal" behavior to expect in our society, where after all, it's less ill seen to cheat than to swing.

Also, notice the "joint decision" they took when meeting this guy was a rejection, for whatever reason (even if the OP vibes about this guy feature).

And, to be fair, there are a lot of single guys who are safe playmates, even for "solo playing", it is just they fight against the statistics since most of the single guys, even when completelly normal, are way off grounds regarding to swinging and understanding the couple requirements, while wanting an easy way to get laid.

I believe no one addressed the other guy here because it's the lesser of the issues for the OP. The problem here isn't about him, and perhaps not even about the solo playing, but to do it behind the OP's back, in a deceiving way.

And again, as I stated before, my smell tells me there is something else going on under the waters, from the way the OP's wife told him about her "affair", as if she were not expecting this to be deceifull. It could be a "play dumb" strategy on her behalf, but if she was properly aware of the OP expectations by then, then it'd be a pretty stupid strategy.

I strongly believe this sort of issues commes from a previous "deceipt", by the time every party express their expectations about each other behavior and the wanted and unwanted outcomes. We all trend to "let some things pass" because we dislike to give it a tought, to feed our fears, and in the hope for the best to happen, and this is the provious deceipt, one than isn't necesarily mean, nor doing on purpose to deceive the other, but perhaps a way to deceive ourselves. We fail to communicate, but not even with our spouse, but with ourselves. And when the reality goes against our hopes, we suddenly face this deception, we get hurt, and we trend to blame on others for it.

This is just the human nature, and of course, it isn't necesarily this case, but for as long as certain odd questions about the whole story remains unanswered, I preffer to keep the human nature option open for discussion, following a motto attributed to Einstein (re translated from Spanish the best way I can): "we shouldn't blame on devilness for those acts able to be explained by the human stupidity" (and admitting I may be the most stupid in the face of the earth).

[intuition897]

Einstein was a wise man.

To Sereneiders, we're inactive right now anyway, but if we were active, we still wouldn't play solo. For one thing, we don't feel the need to seek the company of others - that's the great thing about being married - and for another, personal safety is something every single/solo person needs to be concerned with, and I don't feel that it's an insignificant concern.

Where was it on here that I read the story about the poor woman who hit on a single guy in a bar and it ended with police involvement and the guy screaming at the top of his lungs in the street that she was a whore? Oh, he was fine with screwing a married woman until he found out that her husband was fully aware of her activities. Then suddenly she was a whore...and he was a raving lunatic. I'm just saying that even the nicest guy might be fine until you get him behind closed doors. It's not until you're in a vulnerable position that you see that he's a psycho, and then it's too late. Why go down dark alleys if you don't need to? I'm just sayin'...