Help! Not what we are looking for....

[Jem]

Okay, I have a rather long question.

My honey and I have been swinging for awhile now. But we are thinking of getting out of it, because we just can't find what we are looking for.

We do have one couple that pretty much gives us what we are looking for, but they just moved halfway across the country and we can rarely get together with them now. We still will...this couple is not the ones we have the problem with...but it will be rare.

We have also tried the local club, ads, etc. and while it is *somewhat* fun in the moment it leaves us cold afterwards.

I don't know how to describe our experiences. They are fun sometimes, BUT. The "but" is what is making us think about not doing it anymore. It seems so, ummm, mechanical, for lack of a better word sometimes. Everybody just gets naked and does it. Now, I am not knocking AT ALL anyone who likes the "just fucking" sort of thing...if you like it, more power to you. But we (and especially I, the female half) HATE it!

So what are we looking for? Passion and emotion. Yup, passion and emotion. Some people that I have asked about this choke when I say that. NO, I do not want love. I do not want to replace my honey (nor him me). And we never could replace each other...I am not talking about passion and emotion on that level.

I am talking about sexy friendships. Where the other people actually CARE about me deeply. (notice I said care about, not "are in love with"). Where there are electric looks across a bar, double entendres, flirting galore, etc.

It seems like we cannot get that in swinging as far as we have found. We want that "take me now" urgency with people who will still care about us when we are done.

I don't know if I am explaining this in a way anyone else will understand. But is what we are looking for just not out there? Is swinging the wrong place for us? Where should we go to get what we want? Any help is appreciated!

[danc694u]

I think that is refered to as the Holy Grail of swinging.

We're still looking for it too.

[JustAskJulie]

We have a few friends that fall into this category. Two couples that I would really say fit it, and in both cases we didn't find them through the lifestyle really. Actually, we found both couples through my amateur site (one runs their own amtaeur site, the other couple joined mine at one point and we met them at a party for my site) and became great friends. We all hang out together and do things other than swinging things, we play cards we go to swinger dances together, and sometimes we even play together.

One of the keys we have found for developing this sort of thing is 1)finding other couples (pure luck) that are looking for the same thing - friendship, and 2)making sure that sex is never a priority when we get together. If it happens it happens, but whether or not it does, there is always lots of flirting and comments passed around.

[Stratecpl]

Jem,

You said our feelings so well that we had to re-read your post several times!

We are also in the exact situation that y'all are in. If you remember awhile back we started a thread about taking a vacation from swinging? Well, at that time we wanted to express the same problems that you did, but it just didn't turn out that way... LOL

Like you, we look for friendships FIRST and foremost. Yes, we encounter plenty one-night standers along the way.... but we have found two (Dance's Holy Grail) couples that are friends whether it's for a friendly get-together, a movie, barbequeing, or playing adult games together. As you said, friends first, then sex. We wanted the deeper feelings, like caring about each other. Not love, because we don't want to replace each other. But caring, and liking each other enough that there is a desire to return, time and time again to visit or play.

There are members right here on this board who will be putting on the boxing gloves because of this, but we don't look just for sex. Most people DO. We have talked with many who have explained it rather well, of why they are not looking for friends because they don't need friends, they only want sex. You are right, it IS far too mechanical and ordered if you go strictly for sex. It seems that so many are interested ONLY in fulfilling their own desires for raw sex, but could care less if the partner they play with gets his/her satisfaction from it as well. It's become a form of recreation, or exercise, if you will...

We are not bedpost notchers. Most swingers play more often than we do because most are probably looking for shallower relationships than we are. We have run the gamut of ads, parties, etc.... we have met some very nice people, too, but very few that we'd be comfortable with in swinging situations. I'd rather have one couple that are friends than two dozen who only want to jump our bones, then leave to find someone else. That type can just keep right on looking!

Like you, our two couples live far enough away that we can't get together often. But when we do, it's wonderful. We all have kids that are basically the same age, so the children enjoy each others' company. We adults find plenty to do together. Couples who either have grown children, or who do not have any children, simply cannot grasp how it is to swing when you have children. These two couples DO. We think this is VERY important.

Hope you guys find that illusive couple!

Ron, Husband of Stratecpl

[Jem]

I am so glad that some of you seem to understand what I am talking about!

But what do we do? We have pretty much decided that we don't want any more of the "mechanical sex" swinging.

We try to tell people what we want BEFORE we meet (or when we first meet if at a club) but it's like they must just not get what we are talking about.

What ends up happening is one of two things. Either they just go with some niceties of conversation and then straight into starting sex. In this case, I realize we are partly to blame for going along with it when we don't really want to. Sometimes we have a hard time saying no, which is why we are thinking about just not doing swinging anymore.

Or we try to work things the way we like them and people get HORRIBLY offended. Sometimes when I am being flirty with the other man, the other woman gets VERY upset. I've actually been told that my behavior was "inappropriate" just because I was trying to be flirty instead of just stripping down and getting naked. Or gotten dirty looks for acting the way I like to act, etc.

We have once or twice gone to "regular" bars and split up and flirted with singles in the interest of at least a threesome. THAT always goes GREAT...at first. We get the flirty, electric thing that we like going on. But since we don't like to string anyone along, we quickly mention that our significant other is with us as well. BOOM, end of interest by singles in regular bars.

I just don't want to piss off anymore people, offend anymore people, or have any more swinging sex I feel cold and regretful about the next morning. But we don't want to give up the dream either. So should we just quit trying to swing and hope it will fall in our laps someday? Or what?

[Alura]

Hi, Jem!

We are another of those couples looking for the "Holy Grail" of swinging. It's elusive but well worth it when it's found. In twenty years of marriage we've played with five couples, three of whom were wonderful friends and lasting relationships. For one reason or another we don't play with them any more and are not really looking hard to find anyone.

We have lots of "straight" friends, several of whom could eventually become playmates but we are not in a hurry. We've fulfilled all our fantasies and feel no urgancy to play again. We can wait for the right situation.

We just enjoy each other, enjoy the folks who post regularly on this board, (who are very wise and intellectually fulfilling people), put our energies into our kids, and wait. It's happened before; it'll happen again.

Alura

[Close Encounters]

With 20 years in the lifestyle under our belts we have managed to make many "Holy Grail" relationships. Friends so close we attend family weddings and funerals together. The key to finding these perfect friends is to STOP looking.
When you go out, go out to have a good time period. Sooner or later you will meet a couple you have a great deal in common with. When you do, don't make a date to swing. Instead invite them to join you in a non-swing thing that you both have an interest in, air hockey to zoo visit what ever it may be.
You build friendships in the swing community "hmm do we have our own neighborhood" the same way you do anywhere else.

[Stratecpl]

Alura,

I like the way you guys think! Sounds very reasonable, AND kinda gives me renewed enthusiasm. We all enjoy your views, too!

Jem,

On the subject of the single men, we have been pretty lucky there, too. We have two or three who are great friends and will probably remain as friends for many years. Two are very far away, but come here to visit when they are able. The third is so full of energy, he's all over the place all the time! When he wants to visit, he calls beforetime so we will be expecting him. Plus, he never "no-shows" on us! (A real PLUS in our book!!)

We have encountered a few singles who are alarmed that I am also playing.... we spell it out beforehand, and if they don't like it then they are free to break off the engagement. But mostly, singles will show up because they want to get laid. It's all in the pre-meeting communications that help us weed out the serious guys from the notchers.

Our friends who also play were interesting. One couple goes to the same club parties we go to. Everyone knows them but very few are into playing with them. Well, their loss! We always sit, dance, cut up, and have a few drinks with them. It was a lot more of "just friends" first.... but then we got together and played. Since then, we've overnight visited both with and without playing. So it's not entirely a sex thing, you see!

The other couple was an internet acquaintance. We knew them a long time on here before we actually got to meet them. They were also like you, bored to death with the fake people and the mechanical sex. We all hit it off so well that we shared a 5-day Thanksgiving together. Talk about great!!!

I know this isn't helping, Jem, but maybe a real couple will come along who totally respects your ideas and wishes. There are a few out there-- I guess the real cincher is finding them...

Ron, Husband of Stratecpl

[youngswingers]

Hi Jem,

One way we found to find good swinging friends is to make an effort with all new couples to have one get together that does not end in swinging. We find it helps us learn more about our new friends and makes the times when we do swing together special.

[invictus]

I understand the "Holy Grail" idea but that is not what we are looking for.

For us, we have found that the key to enjoying the lifestyle is to take it as it comes. If we go to a club or a nudist resort or just go out to dance with others we get a TREMENDOUS sexual charge between the two of us. That keeps the "spice" in our lifes as a bonus to our "regular" sexlife.
(someone mentioned in a recent post being bored with "regular" sex. I can't figure that one out. If I never see, touch, smell, or otherwise consider anyone else but J and our "normal" sex, then I will die a happy and contented man. Ahh.....)

If we find a couple to play with, that is great and we experience something special. If we do not, then that is OK too.

Swinging adds spice to sex in a very committed relationship. One way we have described it is like watching a video in person. For myself it appeals to me because I love watching her. I love watching her by herself, with me, with a girl, and we are discussing her with a guy (although we have only soft-swung at this point.)
<is swung a word??>

For us to play with anyone, we have to have some type of friendship and connection first. This may be brief and only hours after we met, but it must be there. On the flip side of this, we do not want to have "long term" relationships with the same people. This is not a "one night stand/notch in the bedpost" attitude. It is simply because we do not want to have any potential distractions from our own priorties like kids, work, and our own relationship. If you think back on any relationship you have had outside of the lifestyle, if you had sex with that person then the relationship changed. Sometimes for the good and sometimes for the bad. Personally I feel that a long term sexual relationship with others has the definite potential for jealosy and other problems. We are not "post notchers", but if we only play once or twice with a couple, then any jeolosy problems that may occur will also be short term and not become a larger issue.

We have good friends we will discuss just between the two of us (fantasies I suppose) that we would not really consider for partners as it could or would detract from the friendship. If you look through the string of topics here you will see many discussions about jealosy in experienced couples. This is the situation we avoid and only do what feels good to both of us at the time. If it does not feel right, then it is not.

Swinging for us cannot be "mechanical sex" or we would also to choose to drop it. It also cannot be a new "relationship" on a sexual level. I guess it depends on what you and your spouse are really looking for from the lifestyle. This is just where we are for now.

Still fun to chase tho and still fun to catch the right ones.

Just my opinion,
M

[ 03-11-2002: Message edited by: invictus ]

[pelagic argosy]

It's funny-I get crucified on another thread because I say most swingers only want sex, and then I find another thread where everyone complains that most swingers only want sex. hmmm

My wife and I are not disappointed with swinging because we were realists, and knew that the nature of the activity doesn't exactly lend itself to relationship building

[martin]

we had a 3way with a girl a couple of years ago and had lost contact for a while . last week out of the blue she got in touch with us and we all got together for a evening of fun. we had a few drinks and then things got cozy and we went to the bedroom,after a very short while this girl is sort of gazing off into the ozone and my wife asks her if she was bored and the reply was yes. we were a little taken aback as she just seemed to have lost interest after the big build up and after it was her that called us. what a let down. not to mention a blow to our combined egos. we guess that it may have been nerves but its not like we havent been together before. but the wife seems to think like has been stated here that maybe we need to put more into the relationship than just sex. i was embarassed to say the least that anyone would call us boring. its weird she seemed so into it and then poof it was gone.i wonder sometimes if this girl dosent use drugs or something it was really strange.

[Stratecpl]

I guess the word bored did take you aback a little.. But I have to say that being "bored" is another reason Ron and I have gotten less enthusiastic about swinging... It's lost it's thrill to me lately. It seems that it has became more of a chore than an adventure. I guess we just need a break from it too.

Connie

[sccple29073]

Hi Jem,
Just wanted to say that I am another one looking for the same. My hubby and I have only done a few mff threesomes and haven't actually gotten into the "full swing of things"..lol.. With the right couple then yes, but right now we are still new to the lifestyle and taking it slow and he is happy even if he is just "enjoying the show".
I know exactly where you are coming from as far as wanting more. In chat rooms...personal ads...and others I have met a lot of people that just want "another notch on their belt". But I just feel that sex is better if you know someone and like the fact that when i see that couple it is not always just for sex.
Before giving up I would like to give you a suggestion though. I don't know if you have ever tried yahoo or msn. Both have an area on their site to create and/or join clubs (they are free.) I personally have created a club on yahoo, for ladies and couples in my area. We have weekly chats and have a club meet every month.
The club meets are still kinda small(i think because there are a lot of people that want to keep it on a sex only basis.)We meet up at a local sports bar and b.s. and play pool. I make it clear that anything beyond friendship is not part of the club so no one expects anything from anyone. of course, Everyone there is a swinging cple or a bi-female and I have made a lot of friends from it..some that have gone to a sexual level.

You may want to try this before "giving up" but like someone said in prev responses. Don't give up on it totally if it is something you enjoy. Keep your mind open and stop looking. I have had some good experiences with friends when i least expected it.Good luck in your search and hope you find what you are looking for.

hll

[danc694u]

Originally posted by pelagic argosy:
<STRONG>It's funny-I get crucified on another thread because I say most swingers only want sex, and then I find another thread where everyone complains that most swingers only want sex. hmmm</STRONG>

Uh..I want a beer!

Pelagic, we don't always agree with some of your post (bet you didn't know that LOL). But, I do find this one funny as hell. And, we do agree somewhat.

It's like one of those "psycho" test. They ask the same question 3 times, but worded differant, trying to trip you up LMAO.

In all honesty, we go to socials to have fun and that includes SEX! After all, we could get plastered/dance/hug/cop a feel anywhere. But, we can't get a willing partner(s) anywhere.