When to drop the subject...

[DBL D]

Hopefully there are a few lurkers or others who can answer this question:

How long would you consider promoting the lifestyle to your SO before you decided that either it was the worst thing you had ever decided to bring up with your SO or realize that it is just to much to handle and just drop the subject?

We have heard a lot about how to bring up the subject to your SO but what made you decide that your fantasy is just too much to deal with before you quit trying? I'm sure you have tried to be patient with your SO on this but there must come a time when you say it isn't worth it and go back to living your own frustrated life without the realization of your fantasies?

Male D

[girlsnboys]

You may want to abandon the topic, if its piqued her interest she will keep it on the backburner, this way you're not pushing the idea.

Back when we were gf/bf first we talked about it, he was more the one that was promoting it. I was open to the idea but we were so young and our relationship was still new. After having a couple of unsuccessful threesomes, we shelved the whole notion for a long time. After seven years we came back to it, and tried couples and swapping - it seems we had found our niche.

For me the best thing that happened was when he dropped the subject entirely. This gave me the space to think it about it on my own, and not feel swayed or pressured - or that I wasn't enough for my partner. Although it took a long time for both of us come around and understand where eachother stood, we're better for it and enjoying the fruits of the lifestyle.

[iapr]

As always I am reading between the lines here but I think you have more issues than when to drop the subject of swinging. To directly answer your question, now is the time to drop it. The fact that you are writing here says that you asked her and she didn't go for it so she has given you her answer regardless of what the exact words that came out of her mouth were.

No since you have used words like "back to your frustrated life" and "never realizing a fantasy" I would say that you still have some wild oats to sow and that maybe a life of monogamy with this particular SO is not for you. If you feel that strongly about it not only will it be making you miserable but you are probably making her miserable too in that she knows that she is keeping you from doing what you want to do.

[Second of 2]

Originally Posted by iapr

... since you have used words like "back to your frustrated life" and "never realizing a fantasy" I would say that you still have some wild oats to sow and that maybe a life of monogamy with this particular SO is not for you. If you feel that strongly about it not only will it be making you miserable but you are probably making her miserable too in that she knows that she is keeping you from doing what you want to do.

[flkeyscouple]

Since the OP is DBL D, and DBL D posts about swinging with Fem D, I presume the question isn't about them as a couple, but thrown out there for discussion, or possibly as a 'hint' to someone they know??

Anyway, to answer the OP, I'd say that the progression of talking about swinging differs from one couple to the next. For us we talked about sex, not necessarily swinging, and had an experience in a voyeur/exhibitionist way. That led to much more talking, but also YEARS of ONLY talking. Had we not had that 'many years of ONLY talking' I'm not sure we'd have ever gotten to where we are now. Neither of us 'dropped' the subject - we always talked (and fantasized) but we didn't pursue it.

Again - differs from one couple to the next. Of course in our case, neither one of us was refusing - we were both interested.

Sarah

[NJCouple]

My husband has always shared his fantasies with me and I was willing to be adventurous to a point. I finally arranged a 3 some for our tenth anniversary as a surprise for my husband. Thats a lot of years of using it as a fantasy, but not acting upon it. We enjoyed fantasizing about our threesome afterward as well, but life got busy (I had a small business) and I gained some weight and was uncomfortable with the idea. It's been 15 more years. I've lost the weight. Hubby showed me a few sites like this to tease my interest again. We particularly like reading hot stories. Well, I set up some threesomes and signed us on to a few sites, etc. We've jumped in now and are having a great time. No-one should ever be pressured into swinging, but that does not mean that people do not grow and change as do relationships. We were married at 19 and were hardly mature enough to handle swinging. After twenty-five years of marraige, our trust and confidence in each other and our relationship is such that we can truly enjoy the lifestyle. I don't think you can place a time limit on this, but maybe instead of pushing to swing encourage her to share it as a fantasy by watching videos, reading stories, role playing etc.
Sharon

[DBL D]

Fem D here

We have been in the lifestyle for 3 years now.
I don't really know why I'm having such a hard time with it. It kills me to think that I'm keeping Male D from doing things he has dreamed of for years now.
I am feeling more comfy with all that goes into the lifestyle. It really is hard work to find couples that are all on the same page and sometimes it feels like that it's because I have done or NOT done something right.
If we write to a couple and every one is happy, try to make a date and they drop OFF. It's not my falt . I feel like I get the bad end of it because we lost them.
I feel like Male D is upset with me more than he should be because we have had alot of no thank you, or no messages at all.
We have had to take a break due to some health issues so it has been really slow. But I have to say it's always slow because of me anyway.
I do want to keep working on finding new couples and chatting with old friends when we can.

I'm sad to hear that Male D is so frustrated with our real life
Fem D

[aahours1]

The subject was brought up by YOU and I would presume a number of time. If you push to hard and NAG her about it, you might as well forget it. Take your time, bring her around by showing her what goes on at the socials. Then you do not have to go back to a room with someone. Get horney and take her back to the room by yourselves. Take it slow to her and let her make the decision to swing with another couple. When we 1st started my fiance' told me that if anyone else would touch her, especially a gal, she would put tjem in their place and hit them. Now we own a swingers club and have alot of fun doing the soaicls and going back to the room with others.

[flkeyscouple]

Originally Posted by DBL D

Fem D here
I am feeling more comfy with all that goes into the lifestyle. It really is hard work to find couples that are all on the same page and sometimes it feels like that it's because I have done or NOT done something right.
If we write to a couple and every one is happy, try to make a date and they drop OFF. It's not my falt . I feel like I get the bad end of it because we lost them.
I feel like Male D is upset with me more than he should be because we have had alot of no thank you, or no messages at all.

Fem D - it's not unusual at all to get rejections and lose some couples as you are getting to know them. There are all sorts of reasons. It could be that the other couple is new and gets cold feet, could be things just don't click, could be that things click so much that their jealousy kicks in... etc. etc. etc.

All of that is a natural part of getting to know people - even in the vanilla world.

Sarah

[rpu3]

Originally Posted by DBL D

Fem D here

We have been in the lifestyle for 3 years now.

I don't really know why I'm having such a hard time with it. It kills me to think that I'm keeping Male D from doing things he has dreamed of for years now.

I am feeling more comfy with all that goes into the lifestyle. It really is hard work to find couples that are all on the same page and sometimes it feels like that it's because I have done or NOT done something right.

If we write to a couple and every one is happy, try to make a date and they drop OFF. It's not my fault . I feel like I get the bad end of it because we lost them.

I feel like Male D is upset with me more than he should be because we have had alot of no thank you, or no messages at all.

Wow. I feel for you. I would not enjoy feeling like I am responsible for things not working out in our alternative activities.

The biggest lesson I have learned in our return to nonmonogamy is that this is a lot of work. It is nowhere close to simple to meet people in which everyone clicks. We have met with single men, and even that has been a lesson in that a good single person is a rarity. I thought this would be so simple to just have sex - and it's far harder than I ever experienced in my single dating life.

We do not hold each other or ourselves responsible if that "chemistry" or clicking does not happen. We do not blame each other or ourselves if we do not get a response or a rejection. It's just the nature of swinging.

We haven't had the best luck finding people truly compatible with our interests to date, either, save for one experience. Haven't had a bad time, but we want what we want. We may never really find it except on a rare occasion, and we accept that and we don't blame the other for not ever getting there, and we work together to decide our compromise points.

If you feel that you are being held responsible or blamed for the lack of activity, then perhaps you two should take a break and TALK about why you feel that way, why he feels the way he does, and figure out a way to accept that if you are hoping for a good swinging experience that it will take a bit of work, a LOT of patience, thicker skin, and even some luck. Feeling as if you are being blamed that it isn't working out just isn't going to do if this is a couple activity.

[DBL D]

Fem D here again,

It's not that he blames me for people not being interested in us. It's more like he thinks I'm being picky, and yes I am. Why not? If your going to f--- some one don't you want something that your attracted to as well.
Along with me being so slow,he tends to put it all in the same bucket and call it MINE.
Yes............he has desires that have not been met yet. He says it taking to long. Between my less desire and his what (I call a sex addiction) we are on our way to a very bad place in our normal lives if he really feels the way his wrote in the first letter.

We did talk yesterday,but at this point I'm not sure what was really decided on yet. I hope he will take time out to have more communication ASAP.
I don't hold back....I'm a talker and I want both of us to work on what we see the other could grow to be in a better place to make this work.
And NOT feel like its so f---ing hard on one or the other.

I really don't know what to do to help me feel more comfy and to ask him to back off and do some changing himself, but he dosen't see it that way. He wants what he wants and no one wants us. Again thats not my doings.

He would like me to be more verbal after we have been with a couple and I have been more and more. But why do I have to keep reminding how good I have been. It's because he hasn't had his desires met yet so he pissed.

I really don't know what to do. :surrender

Fem D

[sexcupid]

Originally Posted by DBL D

I really don't know what to do to help me feel more comfy and to ask him to back off and do some changing himself, but he dosen't see it that way. He wants what he wants and no one wants us. Again thats not my doings.

He would like me to be more verbal after we have been with a couple and I have been more and more. But why do I have to keep reminding how good I have been. It's because he hasn't had his desires met yet so he pissed.

I really don't know what to do. :surrender

Fem D

Hey there Fem D...just for my own curiosity (and some things that stuck out to me), what desires of his haven't been met? what is it that he wants that he's not getting? and what did you mean by "keep reminding how good i have been"?


Maria

[Second of 2]

Originally Posted by DBL D

Fem D here again, Yes............he has desires that have not been met yet. He says it taking to long. Between my less desire and his what (I call a sex addiction) we are on our way to a very bad place in our normal lives if he really feels the way his wrote in the first letter.

We did talk yesterday,but at this point I'm not sure what was really decided on yet. I hope he will take time out to have more communication ASAP.
I don't hold back....I'm a talker and I want both of us to work on what we see the other could grow to be in a better place to make this work.
And NOT feel like its so f---ing hard on one or the other.

I really don't know what to do to help me feel more comfy and to ask him to back off and do some changing himself, but he dosen't see it that way. He wants what he wants and no one wants us. Again thats not my doings.
Fem D

Oh boy, this is a lot deeper than I first realized. I have to side with you though FemD. In the first place there is nothing wrong with being picky. My wife is so I let her make the decisions. Of course it means we don't do it very often, but so what, when we do it's more special because you've taken the time to insure a better match.
I get the impression that DBL D is in some big hurry to just "do it". I don't see the point in that. I'd agree with you when you call it a "sex addiction". It also sounds like he has some special fantasy that hasn't been fulfilled. If he hasn't told you what it is then that sends off signals to me that he's not sharing what he wants out of swinging. Seeing that swinging is a "couples" activity I'm questioning his motives for this whole deal.
I agree, you need two-way communication quick, you need openness quick, you need honesty quick, or this scenario will become very hard to put up with.
Lastly, I'm more than puzzled by your comment "He wants what he wants and no one wants us." I would read into that, that the reason no one wants the two of you is because no one wants him. Am I reading this wrong?
I wish you well. You two have a lot of work ahead of you.

[TheDeal]

This is hard because I feel like there is no going back unless all agree. AND, it can't be because one is just frustrated with this or that.

When my wife brought up the LS to me, I FREAKING FREAKED OUT!!! I really went over the edge. I spent my whole life with physical insecurity issues. When was single; the way I dealt with those feelings, was by realizing I was more and had more to offer as a person inside. I thought, what makes me such a great lover is not the physical, but the intellectual and emotional. I knew that when I would sleep with someone, they were receiving my soul as I pleased them. Ok now, it worked for me! Of course this totally supported my friends first view of relationships (sex), and also allowed me to have only long term relationships. That of course led to me only sleeping with a few women.

Now, it's twelve years later and I am married to a wonderful, beautiful woman. She tells me that she has a fantasy of being with me and another woman, FMF. Yes, every other guy would be cuming in their pants, but I was SCARED shitless. I am attractive, well, I really think I'm just ok, but the wife thinks I am great.

So, as I see it I had two choices when she told me of wanting to be in the LS. One, say forget you I am too scared and even offended that you would want to be with anyone else. Or, think about what she was really feeling and try to achieve the same level of understanding. The bottom line was however, I felt I could not live with her knowing that she had these desires, but I was just too scared to try. I would always wonder if she was satisfied with our sex life or did she just do it to keep the peace. I HAD TO GET TO HER LEVEL. I am nearly there, but it was a long and difficult road. Also, (I have said this before) the lifestyle is not helpful at all for the guy with insecurities. We are still waiting on the perfect couple and we (both of us) have our doubts as to whether we will find one, BUT we are not going to lessen our requirements just to do it. WE are in this for the whole experience not just to find a couple human sex toys.

Let's face it folks. It's very hard for a couple to survive one really wanting to do the LS and the other not. There are no amicable options, either you both try to do it or one or both of you are going to have a fundamental problem getting past it.

[MoonLightKiss]

This is both Mr. and Mrs. we are sitting here together discussing our response to this because we too have this problem. I ( the Mrs.) am more picky about who we meet than the Mr. (Mr. here, she really is really really picky). And like you FemD, I sometimes feel as though the Mr. isn't having as much fun as he could if I was not so picky, then you add in all the rejections and it feels as if we go nowhere fast. I (Mrs.) feel as though I am holding him back and that he feels frustrated with me for being so picky. He has admitted sometimes he wishes I was not so picky. Honestly, its something we still work on. We know these negative feelings coming up are only going to hinder us further if we dont get em out and talk em out, so we are trying to work em out and are not getting involved with others for a bit right now.

What we have done to try and alleviate some of that, is look at profiles even though we are not contacting others right now. I explain to him why someone turns me off each and every time. Sometimes I just really don't like the way the male looks, other times I see the way they DON'T clean by the background in the pics, other times someone from the other couple will type something I find offensive or rude, and the whole time he is finding the wife to be hot and he cannot think past that sometimes. (In no way am I implying that DBLD does that) We have to sit down regularly and talk it out. Frustrating, yes it can be. But talking about it does help. He is starting to understand my reasons for rejecting others without even contacting them. For example, if I see someone's profile so full of rules and guidelines its like reading an instruction manual on how to launch a rocket, I turn it down without a second thought. The Mr.'s thought was "They know what they want and don't want, so they must be confident" My thought was, "That many rules and its possible they are so new they aren't sure about swinging, so either we will set a date they will skip out on, or we will get together to have fun and drama will ensue." Beginning to understand the reasons why is helping us alot. So my advice is to make sure you both understand the why's not just the what's. I hope this helps, and if I am way off base, my apologies.

Best of luck to you both. And I am sure things are going to work out fine.

Kisses,
Mr. & Mrs.